2006 NASA Se7ens Challenge

[Michael Murphy]

Hi all,

As Gert noted in his earlier posting today, a group of us have put together a track program for 2006 based on the NASA Se7ens Challenge series. The Se7ens Challenge was formed a few years ago by a group of enthusiasts in Northern California. It is an excellent forum to build driving skills, share knowledge and (for some of us) scratch a competitive itch, all in a social setting that emphasizes fun, safety and learning.

Our goal is to involve as many sevenesque cars as possible in a combined Norcal and Socal program. I am posting a copy of the article which describes the program and invites you to join the fun. The program will give you the chance to have fun on the track whether you are novice, an experienced driver looking to take it up a level, a budding time trialler, or all-out racer. Please read the attachment and join in the fun!

We have had a very positive response from those we have contacted so far. We might event lure some hard-core seveners from Texas.

Cheers, and hope to see you at the track soon.

[Roll a 7]

I'm hoping that we can a good turnout of SoCal 7s for the NASA event/school @ Buttonwillow on April 8/9. BW is one of the best tracks in SC and the NASA school is said to be first rate. See ya there!!

[magnusfeuer]

This is excellent!

All of us who participated in the last Willow Springs event agreed that it was time to move to the next stage. We were planning to introduce timing equipment to kick up the competitive edge, but were a bit at loss exactly how to proceed.

The Se7vens Challenge allows us to expand our width from the complete newbie to the full on racer, allowing anyone to stay in the group that he or she is comfortable with.

I think that this will be a very nice racing addition to our blats and other activities.

Thank you Michael for driving this. It will be a very interesting year for us.

/Magnus F.

[slomove]

Brad, I am don't think there will be a real "race school" program at these events if that is what you mean. The NASA HPDE program at the track day event is limited to general track introduction, rules and regulations and mandatory feedback/discussion meetings after each track session (the group leader is on the track and observes misbehaving drivers).

Also, mandatory driving with instructor as passenger in Group 1 and generally opportunity to drive with NASA instructors in all groups. Overall, I agree it is a very good program but not exactly like a commercial Race School.

Make sure you pick up one of the NASA passes/log books and have it filled in to be allowed to the higher HPDE groups.

Gert


I'm hoping that we can a good turnout of SoCal 7s for the NASA event/school @ Buttonwillow on April 8/9. BW is one of the best tracks in SC and the NASA school is said to be first rate. See ya there!!

[Roll a 7]

The description offered by Jon Stokes sounded rather like a school with classrooms etc. I'm not expexting Skip Barber or Bondurant, but I'm under the impression that they do teach proper behavior/technique as one goes through their levels.

Anyway, whatever it is, I'm in!!

[moosetestbestanden]

So, I have some questions r.e. the 7s Challenge:

1. The rules state that only normally aspirated cars are allowed. Magnus?

2. The Caterham roadsport cage is not legal. What about the Superlight cage that's used in the racing series in the UK and Euroland?
Edited to add: I've found it's made from 1.25" tubing, scca specs state 1.375. Why is a cage that's used all over the place there not
good enough here?

3. Anybody interested in a bulk buy on battery cut off switches? I don't have one either.

4. Anybody interested in a bulk buy on the drive shaft safety hoop? I don't have one either. Where do I get one?

5. How much of this is necessary for the HPDE licensing?

[soareyes]

Chris,

None of that is required for the HPDE, just for racing. Unless you already have a race license you will be in HPDE to begin with. For HPDE your car needs to pass a tech inspection (a checklist is on the NASA site), and the only thing new for 2006 that I can see is possibly needing a 5 point harness instead of just a 4 point harness. For my first HPDE last October the only thing that would have kept me from passing tech was exposed battery terminals, and duct tape was fine for that. You do need a full face helmet, but otherwise just jeans, long sleeve cotton shirt, and tennis shoes.

Stan

[moosetestbestanden]

The April weekend's focus will be getting up to license level as I understand it, non?

Would anybody out there (Michael, Woody) care to comment as to how this will occur and how much progress can reasonably be expected?

[magnusfeuer]

I am planning to replace my Zetec with a Duratec during the year. Right now, though, my garage is far too small for any kind of serious work, and I am looking into renting workshop space somewhere in the vicinity.

I also seem to remember a requirement of 3" seat belt width, which would disqualify the standard Caterham fou r pointer with its 2" lap belt. Is this requirment only for racing or does it go for HPDE as well? Michael?

/Magnus F.

[moosetestbestanden]

I am planning to replace my Zetec with a Duratec during the year.

I just knew it. Once you've gone 'tec, you never go back. 2.0 or 2.3?

But, back on topic, I've only got 2" lap (and 'crutch') belts as well.

[Roll a 7]

I might be in on a bulk buy of that stuff. A scattershield/blanket ($175??) for our bellhousings may also be a requirement and a pretty cheap way to save your feet if the clutch/flywheel have a buzzsaw sort of failure.

Also, Autopower Industries in SD makes a lot of rollcages for racing and already knows the NASA specs very well. A bulk buy from them might also be in order. If there is some interest I'll run my car over there and try to chisel 'em.

RMSCI had a used superlight cage a few months back and sold it for $1500. A new one is likely to be more than $3000 and still won't meet the NASA spec.

A local solution seems to be our best choice...

[Rich H]

Chris,

None of that is required for the HPDE, just for racing. Unless you already have a race license you will be in HPDE to begin with. For HPDE your car needs to pass a tech inspection (a checklist is on the NASA site), and the only thing new for 2006 that I can see is possibly needing a 5 point harness instead of just a 4 point harness. For my first HPDE last October the only thing that would have kept me from passing tech was exposed battery terminals, and duct tape was fine for that. You do need a full face helmet, but otherwise just jeans, long sleeve cotton shirt, and tennis shoes.

Stan

The HPDE sevens seatbelt issue is not new for 2006. Its an ongoing question over whether or not factory-specified seatbelts in Caterhams and other sevens (be they 3-point, 4-point, 5-point, or whatever) will automatically pass HPDE tech. If not, the belts in our cars will have to comply with NASA's racing CC&Rs. Its been said that sevens have not been treated uniformly within NASA: sometimes the belts from the factory have been accepted, as they typically are with all street-legal cars, whereas at other times the factory belts have been treated as owner creations, thus subjecting them to the CC&Rs.

Via the Sevens Challenge forum, a week or so ago, I asked the 2006 Sevens Challenge coordinators to convince NASA to allow factory-spec belts in sevens. As yet I've not seen any response, so I don't know whether or not the issue is being addressed.

More broadly, the actual HPDE rules are not the "checklist" but rather are the detailed specifications in the CC&Rs. Typically a street-legal car in good mechanical condition automatically passes on the details, and the checklist thus works fine. But sevens can get hung up on a range of safety items, and thus shunted into the CC&Rs, to the extent that the tech inspector views something as being non-standard.

When I staged the Infineon Super Seven Festivals in 2003 and 2004 I worked with NASA in advance to make sure that all street-legal sevens that showed up in good mechanical condition would be allowed on the track for HPDE. Something similar needs to be made permanent for all NASA regions.

[slomove]

I can not imagine the belt spec to be a real problem. If you have a 4-point belt you should junk it anyway. Then for a 2" strap....a new 5-point or 6-point camlock from Racerwholesale with 3" webbing is maybe $130 and lasts for a few years. That should not really be an issue???? A single track weekend participation will set you back about $400 with fee, fuel and hotel.

As for the racing license on the first weekend with NASA, I don't know if that is practical. You may want to check with Michael or Pierre. I do know that Pierre is working on a special cage deal.

Gert

[slomove]

Maybe to add to the previous post....
I am not going for the racing license anytime soon. Maybe I will miss out on a lot of exciting action but for now I am totally happy with the HPDE track sessions.

Racing just means another level of comittment in terms of car preparation and risk.

Gert

[Rich H]

I can not imagine the belt spec to be a real problem. If you have a 4-point belt you should junk it anyway. Then for a 2" strap....a new 5-point or 6-point camlock from Racerwholesale with 3" webbing is maybe $130 and lasts for a few years. That should not really be an issue???? A single track weekend participation will set you back about $400 with fee, fuel and hotel.

As for the racing license on the first weekend with NASA, I don't know if that is practical. You may want to check with Michael or Pierre. I do know that Pierre is working on a special cage deal.

Gert

Gert,

You are partially correct. HPDE participants pursuing a competition license, as well as many who plan to do a lot of track days, have no problem with upgrading seatbelts.

But most new HPDE participants aren't in those categories. They want to use their everyday street cars, usually with 3-point belts. And that matches NASA's HPDE purpose, which is to provide the chance to try out everyday cars on race tracks under safe, supervised, non-competitive conditions.

Perhaps there's a bit of a "policy" question here as to the desired beginner friendliness of HPDE for sevens. Maybe we should just tell sevens owners to do HPDE in their family cars until they are committed enough to doing track days to install CC&R belts in their seven. Just a thought, I don't know.

On the racing license question, people should read the CC&Rs and compare their own prior experience with NASA's licensing requirements. A beginner, for example, would normally start in HPDE1 and progress through 2 and 3, into 4, and then test for the license. Its virtually certain that this can't be completed in a single weekend, though I suppose that there's an exception to everything. In contrast, however, a person who has completed a pro driving school might receive a provisional license far more quickly

Also note tht NASA just created a new Time Trial license, which may interest some.

Rich

[slomove]

Rich, I agree and I made my remarks not only based on NASA policies. I was rather suggesting that the the belt upgrade is a rather cheap safety improvement of a car with otherwise limited protection. That should be important on the track but I believe is just as important on a Los Angeles freeway. If you can satisfy NASA requirements at the same time, great!

I would not suggest beginning with a tintop. Most of us have been to various track events before, so there would be no real purpose of doing so. I experienced HPDE group 1 and 2 to be fast, but not that aggressive. There is one or the other spin-out in every session and the inevitable road-blocker in a fast BMW who does not let pass. I did not drive in group 3 and 4 so far but noticed the relaxed passing rules do lead to more tight situations and the drivers are more ambitious while not always better.

Gert

[Rich H]

Rich, I agree and I made my remarks not only based on NASA policies. I was rather suggesting that the the belt upgrade is a rather cheap safety improvement of a car with otherwise limited protection. That should be important on the track but I believe is just as important on a Los Angeles freeway. If you can satisfy NASA requirements at the same time, great!

I would not suggest beginning with a tintop. Most of us have been to various track events before, so there would be no real purpose of doing so. I experienced HPDE group 1 and 2 to be fast, but not that aggressive. There is one or the other spin-out in every session and the inevitable road-blocker in a fast BMW who does not let pass. I did not drive in group 3 and 4 so far but noticed the relaxed passing rules do lead to more tight situations and the drivers are more ambitious while not always better.

Gert

I follow your point Gert. I think that seatbelt modifications have to be evaluated on a car-by-car as-installed basis, because the same physical after-market belt when bolted into different cars might have different safety impacts, positive or negative, depending upon anchorage, routing, etc., but concur that its worthwhile for owners to consider the possibility that installing CC&R compliant belts might enhance overall safety, including on the highway. That's actually kind of a no-brainer.

For the Sevens Challenge, however, I prefer that entry requirements (as distinct from peer recommendations) reflect, as much as possible, the cars that people actually own or dream of owning, rather than someone else's idea of the car that they ought to own. I believe that the fewer the hoops to jump through, the greater will be the participation - and that's been one of the keys to NASA's broader success in competition with outfits like the SCCA. Thus far though, I think that the Sevens Challenge is still struggling to figure out a formula that matches that open NASA style.

Rich

[moosetestbestanden]

Speaking on safety, based on Stan's description of his day at Infineon last year I wonder if the "open NASA style" will even be surviveable. He talked of cars flipping and being driven directly into walls basically in every session.

Last thing I want to do for fun (or anything else) is have some testosterone addled moron w/ a car larger than his ability crushing me because he forgot (or never understood) that braking is harder to do than accelerating, or that there's going to be other cars on-track. Frankly what Stan described sounds like, for all their efforts, NASA events may well be kind of a cluster f***. We'll see.

I don't mind mixing it up on the track w/ people who are of similar interest and whom I know (more and more w/ each subsequent event) but I have very little interest in finding myself punted from behind or chopped across the bow by a Viper, or Vette, or a EVO or a whatever.

Here's hoping that I can pass thru NASA's education program w/out crossing paths w/ some spooner and emerge on the other side to drive w/ 7 owners.

[soareyes]

Well, maybe not every session, but there was more carnage than I expected. A WRX(?) flipped in my second session on the outlap so we didn't get any laps at speed as it took awhile to clean up. A new Nissan 350Z (less than 500 miles!) was totaled into a wall head-on. A new Mini Cooper had extensive damage from side-swipping the wall. Of course Dave had his Seven totaled but that was in a race group. I didn't see any car to car damage though.
Stan

edit - After thinking about this for a few minutes, I realized that Infineon may have more incidents because there is more to hit if you go off track (armco, concrete walls, hill sides). I was use to Willow Springs where most times you just skid off into the desert till you stop.

[slomove]

Maybe you were a little unlucky.... I have been with NASA to Willow Springs (big track) once and at Infineon twice (including pouring rain). From what I observed at the 3 events, no accidents in HPDE groups 1 an 2, one accident with limited damage in group 3.

For that matter, the NASA events are not that different from the LASAAC track day. Only, if you run off the track at the Streets of Willows you may get a dusty car while the same mistake at Infineon can mean you stuff your car into the concrete wall. At least NASA tries hard to clamp down on irresponsible behavior.

No question there is some limited risk involved with track driving but did anobody expect different? That is why I installed a reasonable harness, tall roll bar and a fuel cell. I guess I should really invest in a driving suit, too.

Unlike in the UK there is no insurance I know of for track days so whatever happens to your car is your own thing. My insurance (Hagerty) will not cover "timed events" i.e. racing or time trials but I suspect they will even put up some fight when hearing about track use.

Gert

[soareyes]

Yes, probably just a fluke that weekend.

I definitely plan to continue with NASA and the HPDE program as I learned more that day with my instructor than my half dozen track days with other organizations that didn't offer instruction. So I'm looking forward to Buttonwillow in April, and maybe Cal. Speedway in March if my taller roll bar in completed in time!

Stan

[Rich H]

Speaking on safety, based on Stan's description of his day at Infineon last year I wonder if the "open NASA style" will even be surviveable. He talked of cars flipping and being driven directly into walls basically in every session.

Last thing I want to do for fun (or anything else) is have some testosterone addled moron w/ a car larger than his ability crushing me because he forgot (or never understood) that braking is harder to do than accelerating, or that there's going to be other cars on-track. Frankly what Stan described sounds like, for all their efforts, NASA events may well be kind of a cluster f***. We'll see.

I don't mind mixing it up on the track w/ people who are of similar interest and whom I know (more and more w/ each subsequent event) but I have very little interest in finding myself punted from behind or chopped across the bow by a Viper, or Vette, or a EVO or a whatever.

Here's hoping that I can pass thru NASA's education program w/out crossing paths w/ some spooner and emerge on the other side to drive w/ 7 owners.

There's a simple rule. Don't drive on the track if you don't think that you'll be comfortable doing it. The purpose is to have fun, not to be scared. Also, to the extent that you are on the track and preoccupied with doubts about the skill of others, you may be less able to focus on what's actually happening in real-time, to the detriment of your own and others' safety.

As a practical matter, the only training venue that is arguably systematically safer than NASA HPDE1 is a professional school. So you might want to consider doing that instead. Pro schools cost more up front but provide a lot for the money, including faster, broader, and more in-depth instruction than any club track program.

Beyond that, its misleading to generalize too much from what happens at Infineon. It is one of the most difficult tracks to drive. So relatively more people drive off of the road, and there are relatively more things to run into once off of the pavement. Receiving professional instruction at Infineon is actually a good reason to consider attending the Russell driving school there.

[Michael Murphy]

Hi Guys,

Sorry I have been slow to reply to the original questions posed by Chris. I am on the run, but here's a quick response.

- As for belts - aaaarghhh - this question comes up every two months or so and was last done to death on the sevens challenge list about two weeks ago. My view, which some do not share, is that if you use your stock harness in a caterham or birkin you should be accepted for HPDE. If you want to race you have to upgrade... read the rules (see the link in the document I posted)... they are the definitive source. Now, I know that some disagree with my reading of the HDPE requirements and there may be some differences of interpretation by inspectors at the track, so we'll try to clarify with NASA. Bottom line is- if you are using a four point harness, throw it away and fit six or seven point. It is much safer and you should put safety first.

- As for cages - I am having a "low front hoop style" cage built by C. Ray (of Danville) as we speak. Should be a thing of beauty, and pretty darn safe. It will be fully compliant with the NASA rules. Of course if you like dressing your car up like a battleship, go ahead and buy the full Caterham cage or have one built like it. I will post pictures of my cage as soon as it is done. It will look pretty much the same as the cage on the team birkinsport website (again, see the Nasa Sevens Challenge posting for a link).

I should mention that C. Ray wants to do business with you guys, so if you like what you see, he would love to do a trip down south and build some cages for you. Takes about two days per cage and he can work "on site". He can also build the battleship version with the high front hoop. Totally up to you but I should mention that we persuaded C. Ray to keep the cost under two grand on the basis that there could be a bulk buy.

That's all for now -- hope it helps. Call me if you want to discuss logistics - 310 497 0618. I am in LA today enjoying the weather, staring out the window at some wonderful mountains and remembering some notable blats...

[magnusfeuer]

There's a simple rule. Don't drive on the track if you don't think that you'll be comfortable doing it. The purpose is to have fun, not to be scared. Also, to the extent that you are on the track and preoccupied with doubts about the skill of others, you may be less able to focus on what's actually happening in real-time, to the detriment of your own and others' safety.

As a practical matter, the only training venue that is arguably systematically safer than NASA HPDE1 is a professional school. So you might want to consider doing that instead. Pro schools cost more up front but provide a lot for the money, including faster, broader, and more in-depth instruction than any club track program.

Beyond that, its misleading to generalize too much from what happens at Infineon. It is one of the most difficult tracks to drive. So relatively more people drive off of the road, and there are relatively more things to run into once off of the pavement. Receiving professional instruction at Infineon is actually a good reason to consider attending the Russell driving school there.

Another way to mitigate the problem get our own run group. We used to have this with LASAAC, which made us all feel a lot safer. I'd much rather be rammed by Chris' 1200 punds than a fat lazy mustang. No sexual pun intended.

Rich: How would you rate the possibility of our own run group if we showed up at Button Willows with, say, seven cars?

/Magnus F.

[Michael Murphy]

Let me add one further comment about Infineon and accidents, in addition to Rich's comment above...

In my limited experience, Infineon attracts more than its fair share of accidents for two reasons. First, there is a big old ugly wall waiting to catch you if you leave the track at the worst possible place. Secondly, Infineon is very close to San Francisco and I see a mouth watering collection of expensive cars there every time I visit. It's very easy for Silicon Valley's finest to take their hyper-expensive street cars to Infineon for a blast, and it's usually those guys who end up stuffed into a wall. I think that more experienced drivers can get round safely. You just don't want to be learning in a 450 hp supercar at Infineon.

And, by the way, I saw cars crash last season but none of them took anyone else out. Seems like they just run off the road at their own expense. The best was a Viper that straddled the pit wall at Thunderhill. If you have ever been there you will know that hitting that particular wall requires an extraordinary combination of horsepower and inexperience and bad luck. Then again, it was a Viper so maybe it was just the horsepower.

I guess I may have jinxed myself with this posting... prepare for my next message beginning "I was minding my own business when..."

[Rich H]

Another way to mitigate the problem get our own run group. We used to have this with LASAAC, which made us all feel a lot safer. I'd much rather be rammed by Chris' 1200 punds than a fat lazy mustang. No sexual pun intended.

Rich: How would you rate the possibility of our own run group if we showed up at Button Willows with, say, seven cars?

/Magnus F.

Hi Magnus,

As the 2006 Sevens Challenge coordinators, Michael, Pierre, and/or Woody should probably respond regarding the possibility of a separate sevens run group at Button Willow.

In the past I have arranged with NASA CEO Jerry Kunzman to have a separate "HPDE7" run group at Infineon if enough sevens signed up in advance for HPDE. We didn't set a firm number requirement but I think had in mind something in the range of at least 10 to 12. We never got near that many though, so it didn't matter. I still think that its a good idea, but don't know how Jerry would react now.

On a couple of occasions we did stage short Sevens Exhibition Races at Infineon. While those were generally fun, they weren't a substitute for a separate run group.

This goes back to the point that I tried to make earlier. We need to push for, and publicize, Sevens Challenge rules that automatically allow the sevens the exist in the real world onto the track, without requiring owners to do anything beyond entering and showing up with a car in good mechanical condition. That will maximize participation, which will naturally support a separate run/race group.

If it is unavoidably necessary to require car modifications, say for safety, then the rules should at least accept race-proven off-the-shelf parts from Caterham, and other manufacturers, rather than requiring owners to fish for custom fabricated bits in a quest to meet the letter of the CC&Rs.

As I think Chris suggested earlier, we're beating ourselves up seemingly needlessly by not allowing bolt-on Caterham cages that work just fine on hundreds of cars in competition in other parts of the world.

A couple of years ago Jerry and I considered this issue in some depth, and had I think some promising ideas, but encountered strong resistance from the Challenge coordinators of that era. So relatively complex rules and strict CC&Rs remained the requirement.

Looked at another way, if we make it easy for lots of people to get involved quickly, then its relatively easy to add more stringent requirements to address actual identified concerns and problems.

Again, its a question of impact upon participation.

Sorry to be so long-winded - just one person's view.

Rich

[Michael Murphy]

Hi Rich,

I agree completely with your thoughts regarding a separate run group. Step 1 is to show up. Step 2 is to convince NASA that we have enough active participants to justify a separate group. I very much doubt that we will ever get there; but prove me wrong!

Personally, I also don't think it would be particularly interesting to have a separate run group. From my perspective, I enjoy running with a variety of other cars. There is something deeply satisfying about passing all those beautiful Vettes, Porsches, NSXs and what have you in a snotty, weird little car.

As for cages, I am having mine built out of 1.5 inch tubing, which is "over-spec'd" as per the regulations, but after weighing the pros and cons I concluded that my pretty head is worth the extra protection. Each of us can make his own decision on that issue.

[Rich H]

Hi Rich,

I agree completely with your thoughts regarding a separate run group. Step 1 is to show up. Step 2 is to convince NASA that we have enough active participants to justify a separate group. I very much doubt that we will ever get there; but prove me wrong!

Personally, I also don't think it would be particularly interesting to have a separate run group. From my perspective, I enjoy running with a variety of other cars. There is something deeply satisfying about passing all those beautiful Vettes, Porsches, NSXs and what have you in a snotty, weird little car.

As for cages, I am having mine built out of 1.5 inch tubing, which is "over-spec'd" as per the regulations, but after weighing the pros and cons I concluded that my pretty head is worth the extra protection. Each of us can make his own decision on that issue.

In the past Michael, NASA has been more accomodating than your two step approach suggests. Perhaps its a matter of practical details. Let me try to explain. Jerry was willing to add an HPDE7 run group if enough sevens entered HPDE prior to the publication of the schedule for the upcoming event. So it wasn't a matter of justifying a separate future group based upon sevens turnout at prior events, something that I agree would be very difficult to accomplish. And the addition of a sevens run group would not have precluded sevens from also running in regular NASA groups.

That said, however, I haven't spoken with Jerry about this in more than a year, and thus have no idea of his present disposition toward it.

I think that implicit in Magnus' question is the suggestion that the Button Willow event might be capable of drawing a combined total of entries from the north and the south sufficient to persuade NASA to schedule a separate sevens group for that event. I think that he's, in effect, asking for an advance entry number goal and incentive. Confirming in advance the acceptability of street seatbelts would also help I think.

Rich

[magnusfeuer]

Ok. Time to gauge the interest.

How many would be interested to do an HPDE1 or 2 in Button Willows Apr 8, given that we do not have to modify our cars beyond what is needed by the LASAAC requirements.

(I.e: We can keep our seatbelts for now, and no need to install a roll cage until we get serious with full on racing.)


I am in.
Chris? Brad? Doug? Stan? Gert? Michael? Clark? The rest of you site lurkers who want to try this racing thing?

/Magnus F.

[soareyes]

I'll be there in HPDE 1
Stan

[slomove]

You bet, I'll be there. Most likely HPDE2 again but maybe see how it is in HPDE3 but that will depend on the crowd.

Gert

[Rich H]

Ok. Time to gauge the interest.

How many would be interested to do an HPDE1 or 2 in Button Willows Apr 8, given that we do not have to modify our cars beyond what is needed by the LASAAC requirements.

(I.e: We can keep our seatbelts for now, and no need to install a roll cage until we get serious with full on racing.)


I am in.
Chris? Brad? Doug? Stan? Gert? Michael? Clark? The rest of you site lurkers who want to try this racing thing?

/Magnus F.

Also, just curious, who would be attending a NASA event for the first time?

[moosetestbestanden]

I'm in.

Because it's the 1st time w/ them for me I guess I'm a 1.

[Doug Liedblad]

I'm in for NASA at Buttonwillow, hopefully the Alfa event there too.

You need to join NASA if you have not already done so.

Doug

[Michael Murphy]

I will be there. Pierre is also planning to attend (if I may speak on his behalf).

[Roll a 7]

I'll be there!!

Had a swell chinese dinner with John Christensen tonite. Never talked about anything but 7s for more than two hours.

[magnusfeuer]

Seven cars already!

With Brad's famous track day selling spiel, which he usually fires up a couple of week before we get together, we should be able to hit ten.

I'll talk to Ken and see what he is up to.

/Magnus F.
magnus@feuerworks.com

[Rich H]

Seven cars already!

With Brad's famous track day selling spiel, which he usually fires up a couple of week before we get together, we should be able to hit ten.

I'll talk to Ken and see what he is up to.

/Magnus F.
magnus@feuerworks.com

Here's a proposition. If Michael, Pierre, and Woody can work on getting a separate sevens run group I'll enter, and I think that I can probably get one or two, or perhaps more, one-day free guest passes for entrants who have never before done a NASA event (so far it looks like Chris is the only one whose indicated that he would be a NASA first-timer).

I'm sure that NASA membership would be required before recieving a pass, and the pass would cover the cost of one day out of the weekend.

Should I pursue that?

Rich

[Roll a 7]

I'm a NASA virgin too!! How do I go about joining??

I'd be up for some free track time!!

Have we heard from M Bedard on this topic??

[Doug Liedblad]

Brad

For more NASA info see the post by M. Murphy at the begining of this thread. The pdf attachment.

Or go to:

http://www.nasaproracing.com/index.html

There is a link to sign up. The rules too if you poke around.

I just joined a couple of weeks ago, so Buttonwillow will be my first NASA event.

As of earlier today, entry for Buttonwillow was not yet open.

There is a registration link somewhere on the event schedule page.

Doug

[moosetestbestanden]

When you join - it's 40 bucks / year - you automatically get a subscription to Grassroots Motorsports. There's lots of good ads in it.

[magnusfeuer]

It's actually my first time too.

Be gentle to me...

/Magnus F.

[slomove]

It's actually my first time too.

Be gentle to me...

/Magnus F.


No way, you should know Se7en drivers do it rough, noisy and and where everybody can see them!

Gert

[Michael Murphy]

Hey guys,

I'm having trouble keeping up with the traffic on this topic. Sounds like you are getting organized. Great stuff.

I am not the expert on the NASA organization, so I'll leave it for others to work out how and when we might get a separate run group. I have assumed that we won't have enough cars for a separate group but if it can be arranged, that would be awesome.

I am headed to Infineon for a season opener this weekend. My cage is half done but I have assurances that it will be ready by the weekend. I'm sure "ready" is a relative concept and I am preparing for an ugly finish to a hard week at work. Also looking forward to Buttonwillow. My only constraint is that I will be in Houston the day prior; so the logistics of delivering car and self to Buttonwillow are somewhat challenging.

Cheers.